@Advin said:
I agree with the ad slots for hosting providers, it makes a lot more sense and integrates much better with the website than Google Adsense, and you'd probably get a much bigger payout. Adsense imo could detract people from the website because it doesn't really look great/visually appealing.
MC-Market/BuiltByBit had a system where hosting providers could bid for a limited number of slots each week, which I thought was a clever solution. We'd be more than happy to pay for ad slots on LES, and I'd bank that a few other hosts would be willing as well.
Dealing with ads, as a janitor, takes time and effort.
Making a deal, confirming payment, designing or even "just" placing a designed advert.
Removing once paid time has passed - and checking when that is.
Sounds like not much but it can add up.
Automated ads just work, it's a set-and-forget thing.
Also, you are not directly paid by any hosting company in particular, so a cleaner situation in those terms.
Either way, every option has its pros and cons: donations only (no ads), custom ads and automated ads.
I agree. I would probably only implement an ad-space purchasing system if it can be largely automated, but designing a system like that would take a lot of time. I just think it would result in more revenue for the forum and a better user experience.
@Advin said:
I agree with the ad slots for hosting providers, it makes a lot more sense and integrates much better with the website than Google Adsense, and you'd probably get a much bigger payout. Adsense imo could detract people from the website because it doesn't really look great/visually appealing.
MC-Market/BuiltByBit had a system where hosting providers could bid for a limited number of slots each week, which I thought was a clever solution. We'd be more than happy to pay for ad slots on LES, and I'd bank that a few other hosts would be willing as well.
Dealing with ads, as a janitor, takes time and effort.
Making a deal, confirming payment, designing or even "just" placing a designed advert.
Removing once paid time has passed - and checking when that is.
Sounds like not much but it can add up.
Automated ads just work, it's a set-and-forget thing.
Also, you are not directly paid by any hosting company in particular, so a cleaner situation in those terms.
Either way, every option has its pros and cons: donations only (no ads), custom ads and automated ads.
I agree. I would probably only implement an ad-space purchasing system if it can be largely automated, but designing a system like that would take a lot of time. I just think it would result in more revenue for the forum and a better user experience.
Google Ad Manager it's what you are talking about.
@AnthonySmith I propose to start with just a couple of 320x100 ad slots at the top/bottom of the site. Not too big and mobile-friendly. No auto ads, they get crazy. Let me know if you need help; I'm not an expert but I have some knowledge managing ads for press.
6gbp/mo is low. Providers would probably offer more.
I'll offer 8gbp/mo for a banner ad with my face on it that says I'm very cool and you should be nice to me.
@imok said: @AnthonySmith I propose to start with just a couple of 320x100 ad slots at the top/bottom of the site. Not too big and mobile-friendly. No auto ads, they get crazy. Let me know if you need help; I'm not an expert but I have some knowledge managing ads for press.
If the Google ads don't make more cash, then I think this might make more money in addition to the added control and improved page load.
I will get Les V2 live first and then look at the host adverts, and if it's even required.
It's possible that with a focus on content and making it easier for new sign ups to start interacting (we get them daily) the Google AdSense for none logged in users could become enough.
I am not sold on any direction yet just focusing on baby steps instead of my usual approach of everything everywhere all at once.
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I would love some placement advice @imok incase I decided to go in that direction, I have to admit I constantly think desktop only and that's not good.
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@AnthonySmith said:
I would love some placement advice @imok incase I decided to go in that direction, I have to admit I constantly think desktop only and that's not good.
Would Host Ads show on mobile to logged in users, too? Because this is how mobile looks right now, and I can't really imagine any "convenient" location where it doesn't take away from the reading experience. On desktop I don't see it as problematic, but mobile maybe in the footer or header (definitely not on the side as it shrinks the text/reading experience). That's just my take on this. One of many views you'll get. Feel free to ignore and move into any direction you see fit. You'l won't be able to please everyone, anyway.
@AnthonySmith said:
I would love some placement advice @imok incase I decided to go in that direction, I have to admit I constantly think desktop only and that's not good.
Would Host Ads show on mobile to logged in users, too? Because this is how mobile looks right now, and I can't really imagine any "convenient" location where it doesn't take away from the reading experience. On desktop I don't see it as problematic, but mobile maybe in the footer or header (definitely not on the side as it shrinks the text/reading experience). That's just my take on this. One of many views you'll get. Feel free to ignore and move into any direction you see fit. You'l won't be able to please everyone, anyway.
Good luck with the v2 launch!
Yes it's a real concern and truthfully I don't have an answer, my gut says under the post comment so ist not in the way.
Ads are 5x annoying on mobile.
The other rough thoughts I had was to allow hosts to pay for a small banner that replaces their signature on mobile, and I do mean small, like 50 high by 400 wide or something like the razor thin info banners you used to get on forums, then there is no extra space taken it's just instead of the text signature
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@MichaelCee said:
Sorry for my lack of participation. But on the topic of changing software: I would rather stick with Vanilla than start from scratch. That is all.
Also feed me tags. Omnomnomnom.
But what if not starting from scratch?
“Technology is best when it brings people together.” – Matt Mullenweg
@MichaelCee said:
Sorry for my lack of participation. But on the topic of changing software: I would rather stick with Vanilla than start from scratch. That is all.
Also feed me tags. Omnomnomnom.
But what if not starting from scratch?
I guess the alternatives would be successful migration to a newer forum software, or running the latest stable vanilla until the web goes down. MyBB has a Vanilla import feature. I'd imagine paid Software like XenoForo may be even better/easier with importing stuff.
@MichaelCee said:
Sorry for my lack of participation. But on the topic of changing software: I would rather stick with Vanilla than start from scratch. That is all.
Also feed me tags. Omnomnomnom.
But what if not starting from scratch?
I guess the alternatives would be successful migration to a newer forum software, or running the latest stable vanilla until the web goes down. MyBB has a Vanilla import feature. I'd imagine paid Software like XenoForo may be even better/easier with importing stuff.
With todays AI, I guess it would only take a couple of tries to convert to basicly any forum.
“Technology is best when it brings people together.” – Matt Mullenweg
It kind of feels like vanilla has to stay to me, I dont really know how to describe it, its more like, changing forum software is like trying to write with your other hand, you can do it, but it does not feel right and I am not really convinced there are any real benefits.
Honestly, the LES v2 is still vanilla, but it's not a version of vanilla anyone else can use, it has been modified not a lot. Eventually, it probably won't resemble vanilla at all. I kind of feel like adapting what we have for what we want is the better way to go.
I don't know, I also know my 2 big personality flaws are that I really hate big change and my constantly seeking that nostalgia feeling rules my life haha.
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@AnthonySmith said:
It kind of feels like vanilla has to stay to me, I dont really know how to describe it, its more like, changing forum software is like trying to write with your other hand, you can do it, but it does not feel right and I am not really convinced there are any real benefits.
Honestly, the LES v2 is still vanilla, but it's not a version of vanilla anyone else can use, it has been modified not a lot. Eventually, it probably won't resemble vanilla at all. I kind of feel like adapting what we have for what we want is the better way to go.
I don't know, I also know my 2 big personality flaws are that I really hate big change and my constantly seeking that nostalgia feeling rules my life haha.
My two cents as someone following this thread and continuing to run HostBalls, I'd strongly recommend sticking with Vanilla, unless you're able to find something that feels nearly identical. Many people left HostBalls (or refused to join in the first place) because they hated Discourse. I've had people request many times over the years via DMs that HostBalls reconsider the platform choice (not that it was mine in the first place).
People really, really hate change. I greatly admire your passion for what you're trying to do with LES, and I really hope you succeed! Just try not to take a few negative thoughts from people too personally; though do keep the core of those thoughts in mind when making decisions.
@Wolveix said: People really, really hate change. I greatly admire your passion for what you're trying to do with LES, and I really hope you succeed! Just try not to take a few negative thoughts from people too personally; though do keep the core of those thoughts in mind when making decisions.
Yep, it's hard when you actually care no wonder LET does so well haha.
I honestly feel like the platform choices, while I understand the motivation for hostballs and (damn I always forget manndudes forum name) were the primary reason for failure, it felt like less of a fork and more of a new thing, it was a step too far, there is a reason for the phrase "on the OGF"
If either of you guys (collective term) went with vanilla and did a fork, I doubt this place would even exist to be honest, it would not have been needed.
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@Wolveix said: People really, really hate change. I greatly admire your passion for what you're trying to do with LES, and I really hope you succeed! Just try not to take a few negative thoughts from people too personally; though do keep the core of those thoughts in mind when making decisions.
Yep, it's hard when you actually care no wonder LET does so well haha.
I honestly feel like the platform choices, while I understand the motivation for hostballs and (damn I always forget manndudes forum name) were the primary reason for failure, it felt like less of a fork and more of a new thing, it was a step too far, there is a reason for the phrase "on the OGF"
If either of you guys (collective term) went with vanilla and did a fork, I doubt this place would even exist to be honest, it would not have been needed.
People want to see changes, but in reality, it's usually only the changes they personally want and agree with. It's tricky because not everyone wants the same thing, and some people simply don't care either way.
@AnthonySmith said:
It kind of feels like vanilla has to stay to me, I dont really know how to describe it, its more like, changing forum software is like trying to write with your other hand, you can do it, but it does not feel right and I am not really convinced there are any real benefits.
Honestly, the LES v2 is still vanilla, but it's not a version of vanilla anyone else can use, it has been modified not a lot. Eventually, it probably won't resemble vanilla at all. I kind of feel like adapting what we have for what we want is the better way to go.
I don't know, I also know my 2 big personality flaws are that I really hate big change and my constantly seeking that nostalgia feeling rules my life haha.
My two cents as someone following this thread and continuing to run HostBalls, I'd strongly recommend sticking with Vanilla, unless you're able to find something that feels nearly identical. Many people left HostBalls (or refused to join in the first place) because they hated Discourse. I've had people request many times over the years via DMs that HostBalls reconsider the platform choice (not that it was mine in the first place).
People really, really hate change. I greatly admire your passion for what you're trying to do with LES, and I really hope you succeed! Just try not to take a few negative thoughts from people too personally; though do keep the core of those thoughts in mind when making decisions.
You are mixing the nonsense platform that sucks (Discord) with a different forum software.
@AnthonySmith said: I don't know, I also know my 2 big personality flaws are that I really hate big change and my constantly seeking that nostalgia feeling rules my life haha.
You're talking to a guy who ran TextPattern for 20 years because it was familiar. Pull off the scab.
"It's a hard life- to be a stick insect." - Karl Pilkington
@AnthonySmith said: I don't know, I also know my 2 big personality flaws are that I really hate big change and my constantly seeking that nostalgia feeling rules my life haha.
You're talking to a guy who ran TextPattern for 20 years because it was familiar. Pull off the scab.
I am gonna keep the scab, thanks though.
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@AnthonySmith said:
It kind of feels like vanilla has to stay to me, I dont really know how to describe it, its more like, changing forum software is like trying to write with your other hand, you can do it, but it does not feel right and I am not really convinced there are any real benefits.
Honestly, the LES v2 is still vanilla, but it's not a version of vanilla anyone else can use, it has been modified not a lot. Eventually, it probably won't resemble vanilla at all. I kind of feel like adapting what we have for what we want is the better way to go.
I don't know, I also know my 2 big personality flaws are that I really hate big change and my constantly seeking that nostalgia feeling rules my life haha.
My two cents as someone following this thread and continuing to run HostBalls, I'd strongly recommend sticking with Vanilla, unless you're able to find something that feels nearly identical. Many people left HostBalls (or refused to join in the first place) because they hated Discourse. I've had people request many times over the years via DMs that HostBalls reconsider the platform choice (not that it was mine in the first place).
People really, really hate change. I greatly admire your passion for what you're trying to do with LES, and I really hope you succeed! Just try not to take a few negative thoughts from people too personally; though do keep the core of those thoughts in mind when making decisions.
You are mixing the nonsense platform that sucks (Discord) with a different forum software.
@AnthonySmith said: I don't know, I also know my 2 big personality flaws are that I really hate big change and my constantly seeking that nostalgia feeling rules my life haha.
You're talking to a guy who ran TextPattern for 20 years because it was familiar. Pull off the scab.
I am gonna keep the scab, thanks though.
See, I was where you were. I kept it running out of sheer determination. Including all of my little tweaks and plugins I made over the years.. then I realized I was doing a lot more maintenance than I needed to. Converted it all to Grav and it just sits there. Doesn't need all of the care and feeding, and I don't have to worry about it not functioning with a recent SQL database or PHP.
Due to a lack of community support for Vanilla- when it breaks, you get to keep both pieces.
"It's a hard life- to be a stick insect." - Karl Pilkington
@AnthonySmith said: I don't know, I also know my 2 big personality flaws are that I really hate big change and my constantly seeking that nostalgia feeling rules my life haha.
You're talking to a guy who ran TextPattern for 20 years because it was familiar. Pull off the scab.
I am gonna keep the scab, thanks though.
See, I was where you were. I kept it running out of sheer determination. Including all of my little tweaks and plugins I made over the years.. then I realized I was doing a lot more maintenance than I needed to. Converted it all to Grav and it just sits there. Doesn't need all of the care and feeding, and I don't have to worry about it not functioning with a recent SQL database or PHP.
Due to a lack of community support for Vanilla- when it breaks, you get to keep both pieces.
Maybe, but honestly, right now, a full platform shift and all that comes with that, along with the 150 complaints that "this pixel is not where I want it", is more than I have the mental space to deal with.
v2 is vanilla at its core, but its not really vanilla any more, its LES, if that does not work out, no worries, we can move on once the dust settles, I am not going to hang on for 20 years, but maybe give it a year and see how the new one beds in.
What we are using right now is probably fair to say... 10 - 13 years old, with very little change in reality, if v2 sucks we can change, or someone can do it, it probably wont be me though.
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@AnthonySmith said:
It kind of feels like vanilla has to stay to me, I dont really know how to describe it, its more like, changing forum software is like trying to write with your other hand, you can do it, but it does not feel right and I am not really convinced there are any real benefits.
Honestly, the LES v2 is still vanilla, but it's not a version of vanilla anyone else can use, it has been modified not a lot. Eventually, it probably won't resemble vanilla at all. I kind of feel like adapting what we have for what we want is the better way to go.
I don't know, I also know my 2 big personality flaws are that I really hate big change and my constantly seeking that nostalgia feeling rules my life haha.
My two cents as someone following this thread and continuing to run HostBalls, I'd strongly recommend sticking with Vanilla, unless you're able to find something that feels nearly identical. Many people left HostBalls (or refused to join in the first place) because they hated Discourse. I've had people request many times over the years via DMs that HostBalls reconsider the platform choice (not that it was mine in the first place).
People really, really hate change. I greatly admire your passion for what you're trying to do with LES, and I really hope you succeed! Just try not to take a few negative thoughts from people too personally; though do keep the core of those thoughts in mind when making decisions.
You are mixing the nonsense platform that sucks (Discord) with a different forum software.
@AnthonySmith said:
It kind of feels like vanilla has to stay to me, I dont really know how to describe it, its more like, changing forum software is like trying to write with your other hand, you can do it, but it does not feel right and I am not really convinced there are any real benefits.
Honestly, the LES v2 is still vanilla, but it's not a version of vanilla anyone else can use, it has been modified not a lot. Eventually, it probably won't resemble vanilla at all. I kind of feel like adapting what we have for what we want is the better way to go.
I don't know, I also know my 2 big personality flaws are that I really hate big change and my constantly seeking that nostalgia feeling rules my life haha.
My two cents as someone following this thread and continuing to run HostBalls, I'd strongly recommend sticking with Vanilla, unless you're able to find something that feels nearly identical. Many people left HostBalls (or refused to join in the first place) because they hated Discourse. I've had people request many times over the years via DMs that HostBalls reconsider the platform choice (not that it was mine in the first place).
People really, really hate change. I greatly admire your passion for what you're trying to do with LES, and I really hope you succeed! Just try not to take a few negative thoughts from people too personally; though do keep the core of those thoughts in mind when making decisions.
You are mixing the nonsense platform that sucks (Discord) with a different forum software.
I'll be controversial and say that I like Discourse (hate Discord though), but at the end of the day I'm here for the community, so I'm not really bothered with which platform is used.
The platform doesn't make the community, just look at OGF.
Comments
I agree. I would probably only implement an ad-space purchasing system if it can be largely automated, but designing a system like that would take a lot of time. I just think it would result in more revenue for the forum and a better user experience.
I am a representative of Advin Servers
Google Ad Manager it's what you are talking about.
@AnthonySmith I propose to start with just a couple of 320x100 ad slots at the top/bottom of the site. Not too big and mobile-friendly. No auto ads, they get crazy. Let me know if you need help; I'm not an expert but I have some knowledge managing ads for press.
6gbp/mo is low. Providers would probably offer more.
I'll offer 8gbp/mo for a banner ad with my face on it that says I'm very cool and you should be nice to me.
If the Google ads don't make more cash, then I think this might make more money in addition to the added control and improved page load.
I will get Les V2 live first and then look at the host adverts, and if it's even required.
It's possible that with a focus on content and making it easier for new sign ups to start interacting (we get them daily) the Google AdSense for none logged in users could become enough.
I am not sold on any direction yet just focusing on baby steps instead of my usual approach of everything everywhere all at once.
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I would love some placement advice @imok incase I decided to go in that direction, I have to admit I constantly think desktop only and that's not good.
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Would Host Ads show on mobile to logged in users, too? Because this is how mobile looks right now, and I can't really imagine any "convenient" location where it doesn't take away from the reading experience. On desktop I don't see it as problematic, but mobile maybe in the footer or header (definitely not on the side as it shrinks the text/reading experience). That's just my take on this. One of many views you'll get. Feel free to ignore and move into any direction you see fit. You'l won't be able to please everyone, anyway.
Good luck with the v2 launch!
Ympker's VPN LTD Comparison, Uptime.is, Ympker's GitHub.
Yes it's a real concern and truthfully I don't have an answer, my gut says under the post comment so ist not in the way.
Ads are 5x annoying on mobile.
The other rough thoughts I had was to allow hosts to pay for a small banner that replaces their signature on mobile, and I do mean small, like 50 high by 400 wide or something like the razor thin info banners you used to get on forums, then there is no extra space taken it's just instead of the text signature
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they need to take up 90% of the visible screen with a [x] so small you click the ad instead......
Sidenote, I never knew what @AnthonySmith's white tag was until your screenshot because it's not readable in dark mode lol
Other places you can find me
Sorry for my lack of participation. But on the topic of changing software: I would rather stick with Vanilla than start from scratch. That is all.
Also feed me tags. Omnomnomnom.
Michael from DragonWebHost & OnePoundEmail
But what if not starting from scratch?
“Technology is best when it brings people together.” – Matt Mullenweg
I guess the alternatives would be successful migration to a newer forum software, or running the latest stable vanilla until the web goes down. MyBB has a Vanilla import feature. I'd imagine paid Software like XenoForo may be even better/easier with importing stuff.
Ympker's VPN LTD Comparison, Uptime.is, Ympker's GitHub.
With todays AI, I guess it would only take a couple of tries to convert to basicly any forum.
“Technology is best when it brings people together.” – Matt Mullenweg
It kind of feels like vanilla has to stay to me, I dont really know how to describe it, its more like, changing forum software is like trying to write with your other hand, you can do it, but it does not feel right and I am not really convinced there are any real benefits.
Honestly, the LES v2 is still vanilla, but it's not a version of vanilla anyone else can use, it has been modified not a lot. Eventually, it probably won't resemble vanilla at all. I kind of feel like adapting what we have for what we want is the better way to go.
I don't know, I also know my 2 big personality flaws are that I really hate big change and my constantly seeking that nostalgia feeling rules my life haha.
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My two cents as someone following this thread and continuing to run HostBalls, I'd strongly recommend sticking with Vanilla, unless you're able to find something that feels nearly identical. Many people left HostBalls (or refused to join in the first place) because they hated Discourse. I've had people request many times over the years via DMs that HostBalls reconsider the platform choice (not that it was mine in the first place).
People really, really hate change. I greatly admire your passion for what you're trying to do with LES, and I really hope you succeed! Just try not to take a few negative thoughts from people too personally; though do keep the core of those thoughts in mind when making decisions.
Other places you can find me
Yep, it's hard when you actually care
no wonder LET does so well haha.
I honestly feel like the platform choices, while I understand the motivation for hostballs and (damn I always forget manndudes forum name) were the primary reason for failure, it felt like less of a fork and more of a new thing, it was a step too far, there is a reason for the phrase "on the OGF"
If either of you guys (collective term) went with vanilla and did a fork, I doubt this place would even exist to be honest, it would not have been needed.
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People want to see changes, but in reality, it's usually only the changes they personally want and agree with. It's tricky because not everyone wants the same thing, and some people simply don't care either way.
Eyes in the dark
You are mixing the nonsense platform that sucks (Discord) with a different forum software.
🔧 BikeGremlin guides & resources
You're talking to a guy who ran TextPattern for 20 years because it was familiar. Pull off the scab.
"It's a hard life- to be a stick insect." - Karl Pilkington
I am gonna keep the scab, thanks though.
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Discourse is not Discord. Discourse is why I stopped using the OpenWRT forums when they moved from a standard BB format.
"It's a hard life- to be a stick insect." - Karl Pilkington
See, I was where you were. I kept it running out of sheer determination. Including all of my little tweaks and plugins I made over the years.. then I realized I was doing a lot more maintenance than I needed to. Converted it all to Grav and it just sits there. Doesn't need all of the care and feeding, and I don't have to worry about it not functioning with a recent SQL database or PHP.
Due to a lack of community support for Vanilla- when it breaks, you get to keep both pieces.
"It's a hard life- to be a stick insect." - Karl Pilkington
Maybe, but honestly, right now, a full platform shift and all that comes with that, along with the 150 complaints that "this pixel is not where I want it", is more than I have the mental space to deal with.
v2 is vanilla at its core, but its not really vanilla any more, its LES, if that does not work out, no worries, we can move on once the dust settles, I am not going to hang on for 20 years, but maybe give it a year and see how the new one beds in.
What we are using right now is probably fair to say... 10 - 13 years old, with very little change in reality, if v2 sucks we can change, or someone can do it, it probably wont be me though.
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It's worse. Gamified crap.
🔧 BikeGremlin guides & resources
I don't understand why people would think that forcing a doomscroll structure would be beneficial. We're not all twelve. Structured replies, please!
"It's a hard life- to be a stick insect." - Karl Pilkington
I'll be controversial and say that I like Discourse (hate Discord though), but at the end of the day I'm here for the community, so I'm not really bothered with which platform is used.
The platform doesn't make the community, just look at OGF.