Let me guess. Hetzner will release some for cheap but they may be hot. OVH will release some but they will use it as an opportunity to increase prices again to $200/m~. One or two U.S. providers will have them in limited stock but without testing stability.
We will be getting some in, however most will be spoken for right off the bat from existing clients so it might not be open to public even.
Problem is testing needs to happen as well to rule out and fix any major bugs which often happen with new generations such as this.
ddr5, I'm expecting its performance, but I doubt if there are any noticeable differences for low-end VPS.
By the way, I just purchased my first ddr4 ram last year and it was as expensive as my last ddr3 ram.
I have dedis with 7950x currently, who runs proxmox. I am not a provider, but i do offer my services to friends and stuff, mostly game servers as i am decently ddos protected aswell.
The new platform has some issues with firmware, drivers and such at the moment, but debian 11 + proxmox seems stable - For now. Performance is a beast.
He also says this is mostly the case for gaming workloads, but for compute heavy stuff, e.g. render farms, performance on the higher-spec non-X versions is limited by the maximum TDP.
But it does seem like the 7600 is the sweet spot as it can run flat out at the lower TDP.
Ryzen 7000 series is not a good generation, just skip this generation and wait for the next one. High TDP, temperature issues, expensive motherboard and memories with very high CL. Intel 13th seems to be stronger with DDR5 and cheaper, although I don't choose either side of new generation processors.
Ye, I was fucking shocked how expensive the motherboard was. AMD's charm has always been its cheaper parts. With lovingly expensive DDR5, it is wise to skip 7xxx series entirely.
Of course, I can say this because I have 5900x which is good enough to skip a gen.
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@ralf said: He also says this is mostly the case for gaming workloads, but for compute heavy stuff, e.g. render farms, performance on the higher-spec non-X versions is limited by the maximum TDP.
Non-X are also massively cheaper, and you can just uncap or raise the TDP by any amount of your choice in BIOS.
The latter is probably not something for a hosting node, but some could say hosting nodes on desktop CPUs is iffy to begin with.
@Advin said:
I'll have some most likely within the next few months, looking into launching a new location in the US with 7900X/7950X in the near future.
Testing them in-house using a pretty dense dual board 1U setup. Hesitant to deploy anything that is lacking "enterprise" features such as IPMI & ECC. There have been enough times that it has saved a trip that it's paid itself 10x over.
Outside of yabs, I don't think most are going to see much real world difference going from high end 59XX setups outside of maybe our render farm customers. They get into some unique scaling situations where sometimes even just throwing more half-speed EPYC cores in parallel is worth it (and cheaper for both of us) than bleeding edge.
It's early, still have yet to see some of the (supposedly existing) chassis I want to try out actually in the wild yet, and from testing so far I can tell you that I doubled down on more 5950X's over the past week. I was holding out to see but the little lull in pricing made it that much more attractive to act now. I do think as the platform matures it will probably become viable, but from a provider's POV (or at least mine) the early-adopter price penalty is not worth it. I'd rather add more 40G ports and double existing Ryzen port speeds or additional HDD space.
That being said, there is a really high chance of offering some handcrafted locally grown organic small batch LES-only 7XXX soon.
If you aren't aware yet, I believe Gigabyte and ARR are/have already launched some server boards that have IPMI and ECC support with 7000 series Ryzen. I plan on testing them out but haven't gotten the opportunity yet.
Testing them in-house using a pretty dense dual board 1U setup. Hesitant to deploy anything that is lacking "enterprise" features such as IPMI & ECC. There have been enough times that it has saved a trip that it's paid itself 10x over.
Outside of yabs, I don't think most are going to see much real world difference going from high end 59XX setups outside of maybe our render farm customers. They get into some unique scaling situations where sometimes even just throwing more half-speed EPYC cores in parallel is worth it (and cheaper for both of us) than bleeding edge.
It's early, still have yet to see some of the (supposedly existing) chassis I want to try out actually in the wild yet, and from testing so far I can tell you that I doubled down on more 5950X's over the past week. I was holding out to see but the little lull in pricing made it that much more attractive to act now. I do think as the platform matures it will probably become viable, but from a provider's POV (or at least mine) the early-adopter price penalty is not worth it. I'd rather add more 40G ports and double existing Ryzen port speeds or additional HDD space.
That being said, there is a really high chance of offering some handcrafted locally grown organic small batch LES-only 7XXX soon.
@bliss said:
ddr5, I'm expecting its performance, but I doubt if there are any noticeable differences for low-end VPS.
By the way, I just purchased my first ddr4 ram last year and it was as expensive as my last ddr3 ram.
The DDR5 on these boards won't go past 3600MHz with 128GB RAM.
The 7950X won't be a good idea due to 170W TDP. That's above the TDP for some of the Epyc CPUs.
A lot of providers seem to be doing liquid cooling. I've tested it out and it's not good. There's a bigger version but difficult to make fit into a chassis properly without the liquid cooling soft tube bending too much and I can't imagine in 2 years that they won't have a good chance of leaking or the all-in-one pump dying.
Extra note on the DDR5, you get the extra latency so I doubt it would even perform better than 3200MHz DDR4 RAM.
Unless thermals are good, you're going to end up getting throttled anyway so won't see a good portion of the performance increase. So I'd probably say any provider that does it, to do it properly, would need to do 2U chassis or a lot of watts just for the fans.
You're going to end up getting all the cost for marginal benefits, at least until Gen5 NVMe comes out and as far as I know, there's no board that can do more than 1-2 Gen5 NVMe at those speeds. Plus those seem to have thermal issues of their own, with one out of the few released coming with a high RPM non-optional fan attached.
It's just too early for it to be done properly.
You get +50% cost increase, not much of the benefits right now. And that +50% also applies to recurring power costs in at least some locations in Europe, and primary locations in the US as well as Japan.
If you aren't aware yet, I believe Gigabyte and ARR are/have already launched some server boards that have IPMI and ECC support with 7000 series Ryzen. I plan on testing them out but haven't gotten the opportunity yet.
Those are the exact 2 I was looking at. Ideally the full barebones solution (same as for AM4) from ARR. I just haven't seen them readily available. Seems like the B650 ARR board is slipping in, but I'll still wait until the entire barebones is available as its specific to our use case.
@VirMach said:
The DDR5 on these boards won't go past 3600MHz with 128GB RAM.
The 7950X won't be a good idea due to 170W TDP. That's above the TDP for some of the Epyc CPUs.
A lot of providers seem to be doing liquid cooling. I've tested it out and it's not good. There's a bigger version but difficult to make fit into a chassis properly without the liquid cooling soft tube bending too much and I can't imagine in 2 years that they won't have a good chance of leaking or the all-in-one pump dying.
Extra note on the DDR5, you get the extra latency so I doubt it would even perform better than 3200MHz DDR4 RAM.
Unless thermals are good, you're going to end up getting throttled anyway so won't see a good portion of the performance increase. So I'd probably say any provider that does it, to do it properly, would need to do 2U chassis or a lot of watts just for the fans.
You're going to end up getting all the cost for marginal benefits, at least until Gen5 NVMe comes out and as far as I know, there's no board that can do more than 1-2 Gen5 NVMe at those speeds. Plus those seem to have thermal issues of their own, with one out of the few released coming with a high RPM non-optional fan attached.
It's just too early for it to be done properly.
You get +50% cost increase, not much of the benefits right now. And that +50% also applies to recurring power costs in at least some locations in Europe, and primary locations in the US as well as Japan.
Yeah the 170W TDP also means (at least for us) always higher pricing as it's more watts per VM flat-out. A ~60% TDP increase is significant when we're balancing racks and talking dozens of chassis, may not matter for my home pc. That is where the non-X versions are very attractive, but then we're still trading off cores and ultimately density/QoS. Underclocking a 7950X can maybe get us there but without premade/well-tested profiles I'm hesitant to push a product like that, and now I'm paying a lot extra for untapped service. Dunno--I'm in the same boat of having a hard time justifying paying more over the 5000-series stuff. Gen5 NVMe might be nice, but we're not even maxing out our Gen4 stuff yet and as you said dealing with additional thermals doesn't sound fun.
Just wanted to say that we've gotten some of our first 7900X DDR5 nodes (rented for now), will be thrown into the KVM Standard lineup for our New York location shortly
Comments
TLDR credit Dall-e: https://i.ibb.co/Wt4jzB9/DALL-E-2022-08-02-09-53-27-A-datacenter-on-fire.png
Let me guess. Hetzner will release some for cheap but they may be hot. OVH will release some but they will use it as an opportunity to increase prices again to $200/m~. One or two U.S. providers will have them in limited stock but without testing stability.
EEeee
ExtraVM
We will be getting some in, however most will be spoken for right off the bat from existing clients so it might not be open to public even.
Problem is testing needs to happen as well to rule out and fix any major bugs which often happen with new generations such as this.
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any provider already on this?
hostiko has been spotted so far.
I bench YABS 24/7/365 unless it's a leap year.
I won't be moving
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Pebblehost already has the older 7000 series as dedis, I'd assume they'll be offering these in the UK.
@VirMach @NTDN
We already have a few of them in DC available on request.
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ddr5, I'm expecting its performance, but I doubt if there are any noticeable differences for low-end VPS.
By the way, I just purchased my first ddr4 ram last year and it was as expensive as my last ddr3 ram.
MicroLXC is lovable. Uptime of C1V
We might release something soon! Not 7950X, but 7900X. DDR5 will be included as well.
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I have dedis with 7950x currently, who runs proxmox. I am not a provider, but i do offer my services to friends and stuff, mostly game servers as i am decently ddos protected aswell.
The new platform has some issues with firmware, drivers and such at the moment, but debian 11 + proxmox seems stable - For now. Performance is a beast.
MechanicWeb
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Doesn't anyone watch Linus? X-versions are trash, non-X run literally twice cooler and less power consumption, for 4% less performance.
He also says this is mostly the case for gaming workloads, but for compute heavy stuff, e.g. render farms, performance on the higher-spec non-X versions is limited by the maximum TDP.
But it does seem like the 7600 is the sweet spot as it can run flat out at the lower TDP.
does linus sell VPS? 🙊
I bench YABS 24/7/365 unless it's a leap year.
Ryzen 7000 series is not a good generation, just skip this generation and wait for the next one. High TDP, temperature issues, expensive motherboard and memories with very high CL. Intel 13th seems to be stronger with DDR5 and cheaper, although I don't choose either side of new generation processors.
https://purplehost.com.br - Reliable, secure and affordable game hosting.
Ye, I was fucking shocked how expensive the motherboard was. AMD's charm has always been its cheaper parts. With lovingly expensive DDR5, it is wise to skip 7xxx series entirely.
Of course, I can say this because I have 5900x which is good enough to skip a gen.
♻ Amitz day is October 21.
♻ Join Nigh sect by adopting my avatar. Let us spread the joys of the end.
Non-X are also massively cheaper, and you can just uncap or raise the TDP by any amount of your choice in BIOS.
The latter is probably not something for a hosting node, but some could say hosting nodes on desktop CPUs is iffy to begin with.
Hostiko already has VPS with it ...
Prob found a stable setup.
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yo where we at now?
no other forward looking providers yet?
I bench YABS 24/7/365 unless it's a leap year.
I'll have some most likely within the next few months, looking into launching a new location in the US with 7900X/7950X in the near future.
I am a representative of Advin Servers
here's one forward looking provider!
I bench YABS 24/7/365 unless it's a leap year.
Testing them in-house using a pretty dense dual board 1U setup. Hesitant to deploy anything that is lacking "enterprise" features such as IPMI & ECC. There have been enough times that it has saved a trip that it's paid itself 10x over.
Outside of yabs, I don't think most are going to see much real world difference going from high end 59XX setups outside of maybe our render farm customers. They get into some unique scaling situations where sometimes even just throwing more half-speed EPYC cores in parallel is worth it (and cheaper for both of us) than bleeding edge.
It's early, still have yet to see some of the (supposedly existing) chassis I want to try out actually in the wild yet, and from testing so far I can tell you that I doubled down on more 5950X's over the past week. I was holding out to see but the little lull in pricing made it that much more attractive to act now. I do think as the platform matures it will probably become viable, but from a provider's POV (or at least mine) the early-adopter price penalty is not worth it. I'd rather add more 40G ports and double existing Ryzen port speeds or additional HDD space.
That being said, there is a really high chance of offering some handcrafted locally grown organic small batch LES-only 7XXX soon.
NVMe VPS | Ryzen 7950X VDS | Dedicated Servers -- Crunchbits.com
If you aren't aware yet, I believe Gigabyte and ARR are/have already launched some server boards that have IPMI and ECC support with 7000 series Ryzen. I plan on testing them out but haven't gotten the opportunity yet.
I am a representative of Advin Servers
5950X is equally tasty at lowend prices.
I bench YABS 24/7/365 unless it's a leap year.
The DDR5 on these boards won't go past 3600MHz with 128GB RAM.
The 7950X won't be a good idea due to 170W TDP. That's above the TDP for some of the Epyc CPUs.
A lot of providers seem to be doing liquid cooling. I've tested it out and it's not good. There's a bigger version but difficult to make fit into a chassis properly without the liquid cooling soft tube bending too much and I can't imagine in 2 years that they won't have a good chance of leaking or the all-in-one pump dying.
Extra note on the DDR5, you get the extra latency so I doubt it would even perform better than 3200MHz DDR4 RAM.
Unless thermals are good, you're going to end up getting throttled anyway so won't see a good portion of the performance increase. So I'd probably say any provider that does it, to do it properly, would need to do 2U chassis or a lot of watts just for the fans.
You're going to end up getting all the cost for marginal benefits, at least until Gen5 NVMe comes out and as far as I know, there's no board that can do more than 1-2 Gen5 NVMe at those speeds. Plus those seem to have thermal issues of their own, with one out of the few released coming with a high RPM non-optional fan attached.
It's just too early for it to be done properly.
You get +50% cost increase, not much of the benefits right now. And that +50% also applies to recurring power costs in at least some locations in Europe, and primary locations in the US as well as Japan.
Those are the exact 2 I was looking at. Ideally the full barebones solution (same as for AM4) from ARR. I just haven't seen them readily available. Seems like the B650 ARR board is slipping in, but I'll still wait until the entire barebones is available as its specific to our use case.
Yeah the 170W TDP also means (at least for us) always higher pricing as it's more watts per VM flat-out. A ~60% TDP increase is significant when we're balancing racks and talking dozens of chassis, may not matter for my home pc. That is where the non-X versions are very attractive, but then we're still trading off cores and ultimately density/QoS. Underclocking a 7950X can maybe get us there but without premade/well-tested profiles I'm hesitant to push a product like that, and now I'm paying a lot extra for untapped service. Dunno--I'm in the same boat of having a hard time justifying paying more over the 5000-series stuff. Gen5 NVMe might be nice, but we're not even maxing out our Gen4 stuff yet and as you said dealing with additional thermals doesn't sound fun.
NVMe VPS | Ryzen 7950X VDS | Dedicated Servers -- Crunchbits.com
@crunchbits @VirMach just some reading during breaks
something something 7900
https://www.servethehome.com/amd-ryzen-server-the-asrock-rack-1u4lw-b650-2l2t-review/
I bench YABS 24/7/365 unless it's a leap year.
Just wanted to say that we've gotten some of our first 7900X DDR5 nodes (rented for now), will be thrown into the KVM Standard lineup for our New York location shortly
I am a representative of Advin Servers
https://www.techradar.com/news/amd-motherboards-are-about-to-get-a-massive-memory-upgrade
does this mean....?
I bench YABS 24/7/365 unless it's a leap year.