These two are the cheapest internet providers in the world, minus some special areas.
Personally, I think HE has better internet than Cogent.
But Cogent has near Abuse sales and low priced IP.
How about this?
Cogent low-priced IP addresses are no longer low-priced when you add in abuse report costs, and at least from our perspective when considering them they seem to limit how many you're allowed to get based on how much transit you take from them. Their sales team is also very predatory and will tell you anything you want to hear and leave out important details.
HE is better than Cogent, if they serve the routes you want. But Cogent has higher quantity coverage. It was easier getting a better price for HE for higher amounts, and easier for pricing with lower amounts for Cogent.
If you want only US and Europe and want at least 10Gbps, probably HE.
If you go Cogent, make sure your representative understands how the internet works to a basic level. If they don't then reach out to another. And be prepared for them to never leave you alone, even if you ask to be taken off their marketing lists.
But hey all the information above is from someone who doesn't have direct transit with either of them right now. If you want my perspective as someone who does end up getting transit trickled down from both providers, whenever I see Hurricane Electric involved, it's either really good, or really bad. Hurricane Electric also ends up having more upstream issues, whether that be due to them or due to our providers that use them. Cogent, I see more of it, more routes, and it's consistently "OK."
HE is one of the worst carriers out there. Cogent is very good in the US and EU, and poor to bad in Asia.
Hurricane is overall friendlier to the internet, with their free v6 transit, sending full tables over IX (for some reason, not complaining though) tunnelbroker, etc.
Cogent is often cheaper and has more capacity overall. HE is fine for 1-10gig, anything 100+ and outside of very major carrier hubs they might not have the capacity to properly serve you, and it might take a while for them to upgrade.
Cogent can be decently congested but the bad reputation they've gotten over the years mostly isn't the case anymore (besides their sales team being terrible).
Honestly though, you shouldn't be going with a t1 anyways if you're getting very small commits (yes I know HE isn't a t1 but the point still stands). You're better off going with an established t2 with multiple t1s in their mix. That way if you have issues you can at least route around them. No single carrier is going to give you a solid connection to the entire planet, so it's important to have multiple options available to you.
I just plug cabbles and the internet comes from somewhere.
For good internet is is important for the cable to be good and top qualiuty electrical work.
The carpenter who installed the internet conduit needs to have strong hairy muscular hands.
if the hands are weak and puny, you'd mostly get up to 10Mbps half duplex, not more, which is hardly any ultrawebs.
@Janevski said:
I just plug cabbles and the internet comes from somewhere.
For good internet is is important for the cable to be good and top qualiuty electrical work.
The carpenter who installed the internet conduit needs to have strong hairy muscular hands.
if the hands are weak and puny, you'd mostly get up to 10Mbps half duplex, not more, which is hardly any ultrawebs.
I don't plug cables, i plug transparent pipes in places. My carpenter is a princess, she touches the pipe very lightly not to break it, i love seeing her work, i wonder if her hugs would make feel love, or if the pipes can feel loved, if a pipe is bent enough, it'll shatter into fairy dust.
She told me the light that shines through the pipe, even though i cannot see it, it keeps me awake at night and i feel that there is a leak somewhere in my house if i don't connect the pipe well and maybe one day the room will be full of transparent light and i will drown in it (this is why i keep the door open, so it flows away)
Multi homed network at home.
Two gigaflop network adapters connected one with the intranet, the other one with the hot water heater. Double the housing value.
@fluttershy said: Hurricane is overall friendlier to the internet
Not to free(as in speech) internet, sadly.
Yeah if you're publishing and hosting hate speech, Cogent is actually the best carrier to go with. They're also one of the only carriers that doesn't sell flow data to intelligence agencies.
@1NEXTNET said:
These two are the cheapest internet providers in the world, minus some special areas.
Personally, I think HE has better internet than Cogent.
But Cogent has near Abuse sales and low priced IP.
How about this?
Tough call. Direct customer of both. HE
HE was competent, and initially the service was (imo) an extremely good deal for the price. We were all impressed. However, it has drastically degraded in quality to the point that outside of HE-HE traffic it's de-pref'd completely and just a backup circuit (due to physically different fiber paths). Maybe we're being quietly punished due to the whole 1A issue. We've noticed extreme levels of congestion when we'd path to another HE customer on the west coast. It appeared to be in/shortly after SJO/SFO area so it only affected some traffic. HE also loves to shove routes that we don't really want--especially APAC, which took a lot of engineering to undo. Their APAC routing/bandwidth is truly atrocious.
Cogent
Cogent has been fine and remained so (to date). Was equally competent during setup. Way more aggressive/annoying sales, but they'll wheel and deal if you play the game with them. More maintenance, but at least it is planned and we're getting notices weeks out. Hard to 1:1 compare this since they are extremely different geographic locations. IP pricing excellent in bulk. Less congestion and more bandwidth available.
NOC response times seem to favor HE noticeably, but not enough contact to really make sure and the few Cogent items have been non-urgent so maybe we're being filtered due to that.
If both are available to you, get aggressive and see who will fit your needs the best.
@fluttershy said: Yeah if you're publishing and hosting hate speech, Cogent is actually the best carrier to go with. They're also one of the only carriers that doesn't sell flow data to intelligence agencies.
What exactly is "hate speech" if you don't mind me asking? I have not seen it actually defined anywhere( besides by organizations that specialize in censorship and lying ).
Regarding flow data, I'm sure they all sell it, and Cognet is not an exception. If you think you know about their NDA'd dealings with feds, you are most likely wrong.
I may be wrong though and you are actually working for CIA and handle this kind of stuff on daily basis.
@fluttershy said: Yeah if you're publishing and hosting hate speech, Cogent is actually the best carrier to go with. They're also one of the only carriers that doesn't sell flow data to intelligence agencies.
What exactly is "hate speech" if you don't mind me asking? I have not seen it actually defined anywhere( besides by organizations that specialize in censorship and lying ).
speech that goes against the current political consensus.
Regarding flow data, I'm sure they all sell it, and Cognet is not an exception. If you think you know about their NDA'd dealings with feds, you are most likely wrong.
True, Cogent is the only one who denies selling flows. Everyone else is fine with admitting it, and also sells flows to private companies.
I may be wrong though and you are actually working for CIA and handle this kind of stuff on daily basis.
We won't do direct business with Hurricane Electric, and instead have opted to use Cogent + DC house blend in Kansas City where we actually have choice in the matter.
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@MannDude said:
Hurricane Electric isn't a professional company.
agreed, but not for the same reasons as you probably do. If you've ever been in a datacenter and seen a HE rack, you'll understand. Generally single switch, non redundant uplinks, etc. They're not even good at being a carrier in general lol
Comments
As much as I love HE, their routing is pretty bad in Asia.
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What region are you looking for?
Cogent low-priced IP addresses are no longer low-priced when you add in abuse report costs, and at least from our perspective when considering them they seem to limit how many you're allowed to get based on how much transit you take from them. Their sales team is also very predatory and will tell you anything you want to hear and leave out important details.
HE is better than Cogent, if they serve the routes you want. But Cogent has higher quantity coverage. It was easier getting a better price for HE for higher amounts, and easier for pricing with lower amounts for Cogent.
If you want only US and Europe and want at least 10Gbps, probably HE.
If you go Cogent, make sure your representative understands how the internet works to a basic level. If they don't then reach out to another. And be prepared for them to never leave you alone, even if you ask to be taken off their marketing lists.
But hey all the information above is from someone who doesn't have direct transit with either of them right now. If you want my perspective as someone who does end up getting transit trickled down from both providers, whenever I see Hurricane Electric involved, it's either really good, or really bad. Hurricane Electric also ends up having more upstream issues, whether that be due to them or due to our providers that use them. Cogent, I see more of it, more routes, and it's consistently "OK."
HE is one of the worst carriers out there. Cogent is very good in the US and EU, and poor to bad in Asia.
Hurricane is overall friendlier to the internet, with their free v6 transit, sending full tables over IX (for some reason, not complaining though) tunnelbroker, etc.
Cogent is often cheaper and has more capacity overall. HE is fine for 1-10gig, anything 100+ and outside of very major carrier hubs they might not have the capacity to properly serve you, and it might take a while for them to upgrade.
Cogent can be decently congested but the bad reputation they've gotten over the years mostly isn't the case anymore (besides their sales team being terrible).
Honestly though, you shouldn't be going with a t1 anyways if you're getting very small commits (yes I know HE isn't a t1 but the point still stands). You're better off going with an established t2 with multiple t1s in their mix. That way if you have issues you can at least route around them. No single carrier is going to give you a solid connection to the entire planet, so it's important to have multiple options available to you.
I just plug cabbles and the internet comes from somewhere.
For good internet is is important for the cable to be good and top qualiuty electrical work.
The carpenter who installed the internet conduit needs to have strong hairy muscular hands.
if the hands are weak and puny, you'd mostly get up to 10Mbps half duplex, not more, which is hardly any ultrawebs.
I don't plug cables, i plug transparent pipes in places. My carpenter is a princess, she touches the pipe very lightly not to break it, i love seeing her work, i wonder if her hugs would make feel love, or if the pipes can feel loved, if a pipe is bent enough, it'll shatter into fairy dust.
She told me the light that shines through the pipe, even though i cannot see it, it keeps me awake at night and i feel that there is a leak somewhere in my house if i don't connect the pipe well and maybe one day the room will be full of transparent light and i will drown in it (this is why i keep the door open, so it flows away)
Why not both. Multi-homed network.
Multi homed network at home.
Two gigaflop network adapters connected one with the intranet, the other one with the hot water heater. Double the housing value.
Make a new email address and register on PeeringDB.
Choose whichever one emails you the least in a 30d period.
Not to free(as in speech) internet, sadly.
Yeah if you're publishing and hosting hate speech, Cogent is actually the best carrier to go with. They're also one of the only carriers that doesn't sell flow data to intelligence agencies.
Tough call. Direct customer of both.
HE
HE was competent, and initially the service was (imo) an extremely good deal for the price. We were all impressed. However, it has drastically degraded in quality to the point that outside of HE-HE traffic it's de-pref'd completely and just a backup circuit (due to physically different fiber paths). Maybe we're being quietly punished due to the whole 1A issue. We've noticed extreme levels of congestion when we'd path to another HE customer on the west coast. It appeared to be in/shortly after SJO/SFO area so it only affected some traffic. HE also loves to shove routes that we don't really want--especially APAC, which took a lot of engineering to undo. Their APAC routing/bandwidth is truly atrocious.
Cogent
Cogent has been fine and remained so (to date). Was equally competent during setup. Way more aggressive/annoying sales, but they'll wheel and deal if you play the game with them. More maintenance, but at least it is planned and we're getting notices weeks out. Hard to 1:1 compare this since they are extremely different geographic locations. IP pricing excellent in bulk. Less congestion and more bandwidth available.
NOC response times seem to favor HE noticeably, but not enough contact to really make sure and the few Cogent items have been non-urgent so maybe we're being filtered due to that.
If both are available to you, get aggressive and see who will fit your needs the best.
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What exactly is "hate speech" if you don't mind me asking? I have not seen it actually defined anywhere( besides by organizations that specialize in censorship and lying ).
Regarding flow data, I'm sure they all sell it, and Cognet is not an exception. If you think you know about their NDA'd dealings with feds, you are most likely wrong.
I may be wrong though and you are actually working for CIA and handle this kind of stuff on daily basis.
he no support bgp Community
speech that goes against the current political consensus.
True, Cogent is the only one who denies selling flows. Everyone else is fine with admitting it, and also sells flows to private companies.
Sorry, I don't glow or anything.
Hurricane Electric isn't a professional company.
We won't do direct business with Hurricane Electric, and instead have opted to use Cogent + DC house blend in Kansas City where we actually have choice in the matter.
[ IncogNET LLC ] - Privacy By Design
We believe that privacy and freedom of expression are two very important things, so we offer solutions to accessing and publishing content safely.
[ USA: Liberty Lake, WA | Kansas City, MO | Allentown, PA ] [EU: Naaldwijk, NL ] [ CL Shared | KVM VPS | VPN | Dedicated Servers | Domain Names ]
Thanks
agreed, but not for the same reasons as you probably do. If you've ever been in a datacenter and seen a HE rack, you'll understand. Generally single switch, non redundant uplinks, etc. They're not even good at being a carrier in general lol