@KermEd said:
Hmm so complete side question. Donations help. What else can we do to help?
Uhm.. stop visiting LET? Just saying.
I don't support the idea of joining LES out of spite to LET. It also gives too much power to LET and puts you into a community with the wrong energy, IMO.
I joined here a long time ago but left quickly because I really don't mix well with Anthony. Knowing that's changed makes it a welcome environment for me.
@KermEd said:
Hmm so complete side question. Donations help. What else can we do to help?
Might be a strange one and not directly aimed at you, but in general: keep it friendly overhere.
This isn't a toxic environment like LET, where you have regulars ridiculing MJJ's and n00bs all the while fighting each other and you need a batallion of mods and admins. This is a non-toxic place, run by M&M.
I feel like I've always been on good behaviour here since joining back in whenever. Moreover I feel I'm pretty tame on LET (unless someone is a troll attacking a new user). But maybe rethinking the value of being here versus what interests me on LET does need to be considered. If I don't fit the platform I certainly don't want to force it into happening.
The only thing LET was every good for was offers. Biloh knows it and that is why he wants everyone to pay for posting them. On one hand, I can't blame him on the other I hope it fails and seriously damages LET and its overall income streams. I know it won't though.
@Nekki said: Nah, it won’t work, not here. It’s not that kind of place, which I think is a positive for the folks that frequent it.
Correct. LES is its own place, kinda woken from slumber only as a by-product of activity at LET. Ultimately things will settle down as they always do. The buying traffic is over there and the majority of providers in the low-end segment can't afford to walk away from that.
This place is already sounding like the OGF, with vulgarity. Fuckin' grow up!
I pop in here to get away from all the crap elsewhere but if you lot want to drag this place down too, then I guess I'm in the minority (as usual).
It wisnae me! A big boy done it and ran away.
NVMe2G for life! until death (the end is nigh)
@Nekki said: Nah, it won’t work, not here. It’s not that kind of place, which I think is a positive for the folks that frequent it.
Correct. LES is its own place, kinda woken from slumber only as a by-product of activity at LET. Ultimately things will settle down as they always do. The buying traffic is over there and the majority of providers in the low-end segment can't afford to walk away from that.
I think I get the pub concept about a bunch of guys being lay back and low keyed, discussing various tech and life issues in a reasonable fashion. I'm all up for that.
But why try to attract providers if you don't want to give them any reason to expect sales or frequent this place next month? I'm not trying to rock the boat, I just think I am missing something.
Anyone want to help me out?
I am currently traveling in mostly remote areas until sometime in April 2024. Consequently DM's sent to me will go unanswered during this time.
For staff assistance or support issues please use the helpdesk ticket system at https://support.lowendspirit.com/index.php?a=add
We can all try this organized chaos thinggy with a megathread this Easter. Make the thread public, but the deals and/or links to deals available only visible to members. I'm not sure how to do it programmatically though.
@Nekki said: Nah, it won’t work, not here. It’s not that kind of place, which I think is a positive for the folks that frequent it.
Correct. LES is its own place, kinda woken from slumber only as a by-product of activity at LET. Ultimately things will settle down as they always do. The buying traffic is over there and the majority of providers in the low-end segment can't afford to walk away from that.
I think I get the pub concept about a bunch of guys being lay back and low keyed, discussing various tech and life issues in a reasonable fashion. I'm all up for that.
But why try to attract providers if you don't want to give them any reason to expect sales or frequent this place next month? I'm not trying to rock the boat, I just think I am missing something.
Anyone want to help me out?
There's also the fact that there needs to be certain circumstances that help an existing community stick together and add new members to it, and (at the risk of being shunned from this place) LES doesn't have that at present. This, in turn, makes it hard to make the case for providers to be here.
@stevewatson301 said: There's also the fact that there needs to be certain circumstances that help an existing community stick together and add new members to it, and (at the risk of being shunned from this place) LES doesn't have that at present. This, in turn, makes it hard to make the case for providers to be here.
I originally wrote a lot, but in the end it just boils down to I am still confused. Thanks for trying to help.
I expect I should just close my mouth and open my ears and see if the light bulb goes on at some point.
I am currently traveling in mostly remote areas until sometime in April 2024. Consequently DM's sent to me will go unanswered during this time.
For staff assistance or support issues please use the helpdesk ticket system at https://support.lowendspirit.com/index.php?a=add
@FrankZ said: the pub concept about a bunch of guys being lay back and low keyed, discussing various tech and life issues in a reasonable fashion.
This sums up LES quite well. And that for many including myself is what makes it attractive as a place to visit and read.
@FrankZ said: But why try to attract providers if you don't want to give them any reason to expect sales or frequent this place next month? I'm not trying to rock the boat, I just think I am missing something. Anyone want to help me out?
And that is why the more laid back approach vs the high traffic marketplace approach at LET is why providers will always gravitate back to LET after this blows over. If this was a forum that generated enough traffic to make it worth posting offers then providers would be here, not like they don't know about its existence.
@stevewatson301 said: There's also the fact that there needs to be certain circumstances that help an existing community stick together and add new members to it, and (at the risk of being shunned from this place) LES doesn't have that at present. This, in turn, makes it hard to make the case for providers to be here.
I originally wrote a lot, but in the end it just boils down to I am still confused. Thanks for trying to help.
I expect I should just close my mouth and open my ears and see if the light bulb goes on at some point.
IMO, this forum tilts more towards the original incarnation of LET, prior to LEA’s exit, which is exactly what a number of people want. Like HostBalls, it’s an alternative, not a replacement.
"A single swap file or partition may be up to 128 MB in size. [...] [I]f you need 256 MB of swap, you can create two 128-MB swap partitions." (M. Welsh & L. Kaufman, Running Linux, 2e, 1996, p. 49)
Was too tired to properly respond to the latest batch of comments last night without hitting the hay.
@KermEd said: I don't support the idea of joining LES out of spite to LET. It also gives too much power to LET and puts you into a community with the wrong energy, IMO.
Agreed. We have a different audience and agenda. I don't think community participation necessarily needs to be all of nothing for any of the forums (HT included) -- each place has a different vibe and many (/most?) people here are active elsewhere as well.
@Nekki said: Nah, it won’t work, not here. It’s not that kind of place, which I think is a positive for the folks that frequent it.
Baby steps. We've done compilation/mega deal threads in the past with varying participation levels. I certainly don't push for a mega thread (nor do I personally have the time to) for every single holiday. We tend to try to keep them more special (max 3 times a year maybe). Definitely not as high energy as OGF simply due to having less volume of users. But we've got moxy!
@Lee said: Correct. LES is its own place, kinda woken from slumber only as a by-product of activity at LET. Ultimately things will settle down as they always do. The buying traffic is over there and the majority of providers in the low-end segment can't afford to walk away from that.
Well yeah, Anthony explicitly launched LES as a means to return to the roots of what LET was before all the CC/biloh shenanigans. The buying traffic certainly is still over there, but conversations that don't devolve into a insult-flinging shitshow are hard to come by. Call it over-moderation or censorship, but being toxic for the sake of being a toxic asshat isn't something that usually flies here. (Nor do we want to attract those types of users either.)
@AlwaysSkint said: This place is already sounding like the OGF, with vulgarity. Fuckin' grow up!
Better watch it or I'll grab a bar of soap to wash out that potty-mouth!
@FrankZ said: But why try to attract providers if you don't want to give them any reason to expect sales or frequent this place next month? I'm not trying to rock the boat, I just think I am missing something.
Anyone want to help me out?
This is something we're working on, but it's a balancing act. You want a good mix of both stimulating conversation and providers pushing sales. Lately there's been a decline in the number of sales threads. We'll do some brainstorming on how we can increase participation from providers, both through conversation and sales. There's frequently low-quantity LES exclusives (only seen by logged in members) that get posted here and are usually pretty interesting from a buyer's POV. Influx of new signups and members trickling over might also bring some more life to the offer section. Plus... we never said deal threads can't be cross posted from wherever else a provider wants to share them
@stevewatson301 said: There's also the fact that there needs to be certain circumstances that help an existing community stick together and add new members to it, and (at the risk of being shunned from this place) LES doesn't have that at present. This, in turn, makes it hard to make the case for providers to be here.
How dare you! Prepare to be banned in 5... 4... 3.. 2... jk.
I hear ya, but my counterpoint to that is that you'll find a lot of members of LES here that were once VERY active elsewhere, but now participate here instead exclusively (or mostly lurk here... whatever floats their goat). And that has happened naturally over time after each bonehead after bonehead decision drove them away from where they used to frequent (myself included). Eventually the camel's back will break, which may not happen today or tomorrow (perhaps when OGF is inevitably sold to the highest bidder), and LES will still be here with a small (but growing) and spirited community.
@legendary said: @Mason is there any visitor stats to observe? I'am curious how traffic increases after LET fiasco.
Visits
Comments per day
@Lee said: And that is why the more laid back approach vs the high traffic marketplace approach at LET is why providers will always gravitate back to LET after this blows over. If this was a forum that generated enough traffic to make it worth posting offers then providers would be here, not like they don't know about its existence.
Maybe not always, but we'll see. Eventually the breaking point will be reached I expect. Likely when more people (volunteer staff included) start to realize they are being treated as pawns to line someone's pockets rather than building and growing a community worth participating in. If the measure of success is getting 200 new sign ups in a single day where 99% of them post an order number for double bandwidth, then this certainly isn't the place for that mindset. We don't focus on volume or providers that just show up, post their deal, then bugger off until their next posting time (we've even messaged providers to be more proactive answering questions in their thread or risk losing their provider tag on a couple occasions). While we don't have volume, we have spirit™.
@BarryHercules said: IMO, this forum tilts more towards the original incarnation of LET, prior to LEA’s exit, which is exactly what a number of people want. Like HostBalls, it’s an alternative, not a replacement.
That was Anthony's original goal with this place. I hope we're doing a decent job at keeping that vision alive, but we certainly welcome any recommendations or suggestions to round out the experience.
@BarryHercules said: IMO, this forum tilts more towards the original incarnation of LET, prior to LEA’s exit, which is exactly what a number of people want. Like HostBalls, it’s an alternative, not a replacement.
That was Anthony's original goal with this place. I hope we're doing a decent job at keeping that vision alive, but we certainly welcome any recommendations or suggestions to round out the experience.
What is your vision for this place? Whether you need to ‘round it out’ really depends on what you’d like it to be.
IMO, Jon has no vision for LET beyond a set of buzzwords - I spoke to him years ago about contributing to LEB and he had no vision then, so I doubt anything has changed, and that’s why it has become what it is.
What’s important is that you and @mikho know what you want this place to be, and if you can articulate that the members here can offer intelligent suggestions on how you might achieve that. Otherwise, you’re just lobbing stuff at the wall, hoping some sticks and that it doesn’t knock off the stuff that was already there.
@BarryHercules said: IMO, this forum tilts more towards the original incarnation of LET, prior to LEA’s exit, which is exactly what a number of people want. Like HostBalls, it’s an alternative, not a replacement.
That was Anthony's original goal with this place. I hope we're doing a decent job at keeping that vision alive, but we certainly welcome any recommendations or suggestions to round out the experience.
What is your vision for this place? Whether you need to ‘round it out’ really depends on what you’d like it to be.
IMO, Jon has no vision for LET beyond a set of buzzwords - I spoke to him years ago about contributing to LEB and he had no vision then, so I doubt anything has changed, and that’s why it has become what it is.
What’s important is that you and @mikho know what you want this place to be, and if you can articulate that the members here can offer intelligent suggestions on how you might achieve that. Otherwise, you’re just lobbing stuff at the wall, hoping some sticks and that it doesn’t knock off the stuff that was already there.
I hear you and I agree. We'll lay out a clear vision of what this place is all about and post it soon. We've already talked about putting up a "transparency"/"about us" page that lays out LES' costs, staff, donations, etc. and adding a vision statement seems like a good add. Stay tuned.
At the moment LES lacks offers, maybe moderation can find a way to coordinate with providers and motivate them to post more LES special offers.
And blog posts are mostly going unnoticed maybe a link to the latest blog post can be shown at top of current threads with highlighted color (maybe gold), i know there is a side bar about latest posts but it wont be noticed by mobile users or anon visitors.
Forcing natural community development is not good, prone to corruption. The traffic will stabilize, new members will integrate. At the moment forum needs:
Offers. Provider acceptance should be fast at this point.
Meaningful posts with real help to members.
Events. Easter egg hunt is comming...
A very clear distinction vs LET. 1 or 2 points which is better in LES than in LET.
@legendary said:
Forcing natural community development is not good, prone to corruption. The traffic will stabilize, new members will integrate. At the moment forum needs:
Offers. Provider acceptance should be fast at this point.
We are not enforcing the post amount on providers that have been active on LET.
All they have to do is either PM @Mason, me or open a ticket at https://talk.lowendspirit.com/support
Meaningful posts with real help to members.
Here we need help from community members, no question is too dumb to ask.
You only have to consider where to post it
Hosting or technical news are welcome and often up for longer threads with many thoughtful inputs.
Events. Easter egg hunt is coming...
We've done a couple in the past, but as mentioned earlier in this thread, it requires engagement from not only the persons running it but also the rest of the community.
Thoughts/ideas are welcome.
A very clear distinction vs LET. 1 or 2 points which is better in LES than in LET.
A clear distinction is that we don't tolerate the shithousery that happens in many threads on LET.
Banter is accepted, but not excessive.
Comments
I don't support the idea of joining LES out of spite to LET. It also gives too much power to LET and puts you into a community with the wrong energy, IMO.
I joined here a long time ago but left quickly because I really don't mix well with Anthony. Knowing that's changed makes it a welcome environment for me.
I feel like I've always been on good behaviour here since joining back in whenever. Moreover I feel I'm pretty tame on LET (unless someone is a troll attacking a new user). But maybe rethinking the value of being here versus what interests me on LET does need to be considered. If I don't fit the platform I certainly don't want to force it into happening.
The only thing LET was every good for was offers. Biloh knows it and that is why he wants everyone to pay for posting them. On one hand, I can't blame him on the other I hope it fails and seriously damages LET and its overall income streams. I know it won't though.
that's fair enough...
Im ready sir.
Nah, it won’t work, not here. It’s not that kind of place, which I think is a positive for the folks that frequent it.
Night all.
Could use some megathreads even though it won't be with emma gifs.
Correct. LES is its own place, kinda woken from slumber only as a by-product of activity at LET. Ultimately things will settle down as they always do. The buying traffic is over there and the majority of providers in the low-end segment can't afford to walk away from that.
This place is already sounding like the OGF, with vulgarity. Fuckin' grow up!
I pop in here to get away from all the crap elsewhere but if you lot want to drag this place down too, then I guess I'm in the minority (as usual).
It wisnae me! A big boy done it and ran away.
NVMe2G for life! until death (the end is nigh)
I think I get the pub concept about a bunch of guys being lay back and low keyed, discussing various tech and life issues in a reasonable fashion. I'm all up for that.
But why try to attract providers if you don't want to give them any reason to expect sales or frequent this place next month? I'm not trying to rock the boat, I just think I am missing something.
Anyone want to help me out?
I am currently traveling in mostly remote areas until sometime in April 2024. Consequently DM's sent to me will go unanswered during this time.
For staff assistance or support issues please use the helpdesk ticket system at https://support.lowendspirit.com/index.php?a=add
We can all try this organized chaos thinggy with a megathread this Easter. Make the thread public, but the deals and/or links to deals available only visible to members. I'm not sure how to do it programmatically though.
There's also the fact that there needs to be certain circumstances that help an existing community stick together and add new members to it, and (at the risk of being shunned from this place) LES doesn't have that at present. This, in turn, makes it hard to make the case for providers to be here.
@Mason is there any visitor stats to observe? I'am curious how traffic increases after LET fiasco.
I originally wrote a lot, but in the end it just boils down to I am still confused. Thanks for trying to help.
I expect I should just close my mouth and open my ears and see if the light bulb goes on at some point.
I am currently traveling in mostly remote areas until sometime in April 2024. Consequently DM's sent to me will go unanswered during this time.
For staff assistance or support issues please use the helpdesk ticket system at https://support.lowendspirit.com/index.php?a=add
This sums up LES quite well. And that for many including myself is what makes it attractive as a place to visit and read.
And that is why the more laid back approach vs the high traffic marketplace approach at LET is why providers will always gravitate back to LET after this blows over. If this was a forum that generated enough traffic to make it worth posting offers then providers would be here, not like they don't know about its existence.
IMO, this forum tilts more towards the original incarnation of LET, prior to LEA’s exit, which is exactly what a number of people want. Like HostBalls, it’s an alternative, not a replacement.
May as well rename as lowhungballs.com, if y'all wanna follow the teenager mindset.
It wisnae me! A big boy done it and ran away.
NVMe2G for life! until death (the end is nigh)
hairy or shaved?
I bench YABS 24/7/365 unless it's a leap year.
I think you can manage to have a little bit of puerile humour at times without it becoming the defining characteristic of the forum.
Somehow this thread makes me think of the Chilean song El pueblo unido jamás será vencido ('The people united will never be defeated')
"A single swap file or partition may be up to 128 MB in size. [...] [I]f you need 256 MB of swap, you can create two 128-MB swap partitions." (M. Welsh & L. Kaufman, Running Linux, 2e, 1996, p. 49)
This.
We have 2 presidents sir Mason and sir Mikho
I believe in the good luck. Harder than I work luckier i get.
Was too tired to properly respond to the latest batch of comments last night without hitting the hay.
Agreed. We have a different audience and agenda. I don't think community participation necessarily needs to be all of nothing for any of the forums (HT included) -- each place has a different vibe and many (/most?) people here are active elsewhere as well.
Baby steps. We've done compilation/mega deal threads in the past with varying participation levels. I certainly don't push for a mega thread (nor do I personally have the time to) for every single holiday. We tend to try to keep them more special (max 3 times a year maybe). Definitely not as high energy as OGF simply due to having less volume of users. But we've got moxy!
Well yeah, Anthony explicitly launched LES as a means to return to the roots of what LET was before all the CC/biloh shenanigans. The buying traffic certainly is still over there, but conversations that don't devolve into a insult-flinging shitshow are hard to come by. Call it over-moderation or censorship, but being toxic for the sake of being a toxic asshat isn't something that usually flies here. (Nor do we want to attract those types of users either.)
Better watch it or I'll grab a bar of soap to wash out that potty-mouth!
This is something we're working on, but it's a balancing act. You want a good mix of both stimulating conversation and providers pushing sales. Lately there's been a decline in the number of sales threads. We'll do some brainstorming on how we can increase participation from providers, both through conversation and sales. There's frequently low-quantity LES exclusives (only seen by logged in members) that get posted here and are usually pretty interesting from a buyer's POV. Influx of new signups and members trickling over might also bring some more life to the offer section. Plus... we never said deal threads can't be cross posted from wherever else a provider wants to share them
How dare you! Prepare to be banned in 5... 4... 3.. 2... jk.
I hear ya, but my counterpoint to that is that you'll find a lot of members of LES here that were once VERY active elsewhere, but now participate here instead exclusively (or mostly lurk here... whatever floats their goat). And that has happened naturally over time after each bonehead after bonehead decision drove them away from where they used to frequent (myself included). Eventually the camel's back will break, which may not happen today or tomorrow (perhaps when OGF is inevitably sold to the highest bidder), and LES will still be here with a small (but growing) and spirited community.
Visits
Comments per day
Maybe not always, but we'll see. Eventually the breaking point will be reached I expect. Likely when more people (volunteer staff included) start to realize they are being treated as pawns to line someone's pockets rather than building and growing a community worth participating in. If the measure of success is getting 200 new sign ups in a single day where 99% of them post an order number for double bandwidth, then this certainly isn't the place for that mindset. We don't focus on volume or providers that just show up, post their deal, then bugger off until their next posting time (we've even messaged providers to be more proactive answering questions in their thread or risk losing their provider tag on a couple occasions). While we don't have volume, we have spirit™.
That was Anthony's original goal with this place. I hope we're doing a decent job at keeping that vision alive, but we certainly welcome any recommendations or suggestions to round out the experience.
Head Janitor @ LES • About • Rules • Support
What is your vision for this place? Whether you need to ‘round it out’ really depends on what you’d like it to be.
IMO, Jon has no vision for LET beyond a set of buzzwords - I spoke to him years ago about contributing to LEB and he had no vision then, so I doubt anything has changed, and that’s why it has become what it is.
What’s important is that you and @mikho know what you want this place to be, and if you can articulate that the members here can offer intelligent suggestions on how you might achieve that. Otherwise, you’re just lobbing stuff at the wall, hoping some sticks and that it doesn’t knock off the stuff that was already there.
I hear you and I agree. We'll lay out a clear vision of what this place is all about and post it soon. We've already talked about putting up a "transparency"/"about us" page that lays out LES' costs, staff, donations, etc. and adding a vision statement seems like a good add. Stay tuned.
Head Janitor @ LES • About • Rules • Support
Good to be here. ❤️
At the moment LES lacks offers, maybe moderation can find a way to coordinate with providers and motivate them to post more LES special offers.
And blog posts are mostly going unnoticed maybe a link to the latest blog post can be shown at top of current threads with highlighted color (maybe gold), i know there is a side bar about latest posts but it wont be noticed by mobile users or anon visitors.
Forcing natural community development is not good, prone to corruption. The traffic will stabilize, new members will integrate. At the moment forum needs:
We are not enforcing the post amount on providers that have been active on LET.
All they have to do is either PM @Mason, me or open a ticket at https://talk.lowendspirit.com/support
Here we need help from community members, no question is too dumb to ask.
You only have to consider where to post it
Hosting or technical news are welcome and often up for longer threads with many thoughtful inputs.
We've done a couple in the past, but as mentioned earlier in this thread, it requires engagement from not only the persons running it but also the rest of the community.
Thoughts/ideas are welcome.
A clear distinction is that we don't tolerate the shithousery that happens in many threads on LET.
Banter is accepted, but not excessive.
“Technology is best when it brings people together.” – Matt Mullenweg