It depends on the client and what they want/expect their involvement to be, sometimes they're happy to have a fresh WordPress install and do it all themselves, or they don't care and a static site works for them. I pretty much hate WordPress with a passion. Also look at couchcms if you want a relatively easy way to convert a static site into a cms backed site with a customer access with exactly only the amount of access you want them to have.
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Amitz, a very stable genius (it's true!) and Grand Rectumfier of the official LESLOS® (LES League of Shitposters).
Certified braindead since 1974 and still perfectly happy.
The addons are done by a third party though. Anyway, with or without site builders, people are going to use lots of plugins anyway and any of them could have vulnerabilities. Using wordpress is eventually going to get your site hacked if you just use the default wordpress installation with softaculous or whatever on a panel. It's not if, but when.
Elementor, even in free version, can give lots of design options. I'd go with that if choosing a page builder.
I chose GeneratePress theme to work with Elementor (it's very well documented, well written, fast - and, like any theme when you are using a page builder - it doesn't affect the design too much).
The problem with elementor is that I don't think you get to keep content written using it if you decide to stop using it. Unlike themes, where posts and pages remain after you change a theme, just looking differently, with Elementor I'm not sure that you will not need to re-write the page content. Could be wrong. Could be there's a tool for export/import, not sure.
WP itself is slowly moving towards being a page builder in itself. Sure, themes and page builders will still have their place, but one will be able to make very nice design even without a page builder (more and more options are added, even more are planned).
WP has its pros and cons. Having weighed them, I had decided to use it and so far so good - even five years after having first started.
@bikegremlin said:
Elementor, even in free version, can give lots of design options. I'd go with that if choosing a page builder.
I chose GeneratePress theme to work with Elementor (it's very well documented, well written, fast - and, like any theme when you are using a page builder - it doesn't affect the design too much).
The problem with elementor is that I don't think you get to keep content written using it if you decide to stop using it. Unlike themes, where posts and pages remain after you change a theme, just looking differently, with Elementor I'm not sure that you will not need to re-write the page content. Could be wrong. Could be there's a tool for export/import, not sure.
WP itself is slowly moving towards being a page builder in itself. Sure, themes and page builders will still have their place, but one will be able to make very nice design even without a page builder (more and more options are added, even more are planned).
WP has its pros and cons. Having weighed them, I had decided to use it and so far so good - even five years after having first started.
Agree with a lot of things you said. However, Gutenberg (WP's Builder) is nowhere near where I'd give it a try. That being said, I don't see Elementor or Divi going away. They'll just be premium page builders with even more options, updates etc. With the Divi Lifetime license I'm quite interested to see what they have in mind for the years to come
I should check out GeneratePress Theme, too. Nothing bad with a clean theme. I often find myself using a clean theme and Divi Builder plugin instead of Divi Theme. Although Divi Theme is by no means bad.
@dahartigan said:
It depends on the client and what they want/expect their involvement to be, sometimes they're happy to have a fresh WordPress install and do it all themselves, or they don't care and a static site works for them. I pretty much hate WordPress with a passion. Also look at couchcms if you want a relatively easy way to convert a static site into a cms backed site with a customer access with exactly only the amount of access you want them to have.
WordPress makes a lot of things easy, just that I always worry about the security aspect.
@dahartigan said:
It depends on the client and what they want/expect their involvement to be, sometimes they're happy to have a fresh WordPress install and do it all themselves, or they don't care and a static site works for them. I pretty much hate WordPress with a passion. Also look at couchcms if you want a relatively easy way to convert a static site into a cms backed site with a customer access with exactly only the amount of access you want them to have.
WordPress makes a lot of things easy, just that I always worry about the security aspect.
I do too, a lot. A few of the servers I manage have WordPress sites and it's crazy the amount of compromised installs appear. Biggest giveaway is the mail limit notifications come in.. can be fun cleaning things up, usually don't do that unless paid specifically for that task lol
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Ympker said: However, Gutenberg (WP's Builder) is nowhere near where I'd give it a try
From a developer point of view it's great. You can make custom widgets to suit whatever design you need, and then your users can adjust pages to suit without any extra plugins/bloat.
The downside is maybe needs more options out the box.
I don't design websites, but I do get the odd job to implement a design in WP - I've not done one yet where a bit of coding to add custom widgets to gutenberg make the whole thing easy. Especially if it's a style/element that's re-used throughout the side.
dahartigan said: I do too, a lot. A few of the servers I manage have WordPress sites and it's crazy the amount of compromised installs appear.
There are a lot of quick things you can do at a server level to help, for example not allowing PHP scripts to be executed in the uploads directory. It won't stop everything but it helps.
Ympker said: However, Gutenberg (WP's Builder) is nowhere near where I'd give it a try
From a developer point of view it's great. You can make custom widgets to suit whatever design you need, and then your users can adjust pages to suit without any extra plugins/bloat.
The downside is maybe needs more options out the box.
I don't design websites, but I do get the odd job to implement a design in WP - I've not done one yet where a bit of coding to add custom widgets to gutenberg make the whole thing easy. Especially if it's a style/element that's re-used throughout the side.
dahartigan said: I do too, a lot. A few of the servers I manage have WordPress sites and it's crazy the amount of compromised installs appear.
There are a lot of quick things you can do at a server level to help, for example not allowing PHP scripts to be executed in the uploads directory. It won't stop everything but it helps.
Maybe I'm just too used to Divi. I don't think Gutenberg is all that bad. It's just not something for me (yet)
There are a lot of features in wordpress but are "hidden" which may make gutenberg look less useful than it really is. People either don't know or forget they can use css in wordpress. I've managed to achieve some things with gutenberg blocks by playing with the css which would have been quite difficult to achieve with classic wordpress unless you have a visual editor.
You can also, for example, create your own page/post templates with php (by writing it yourself and uploading it to wordpress directory). I'm sure there are a lot of 'hidden' features that I'm unaware of myself. However, it should be noted that wordpress development is an entirely different monster compared to webdev...
Comments
It depends on the client and what they want/expect their involvement to be, sometimes they're happy to have a fresh WordPress install and do it all themselves, or they don't care and a static site works for them. I pretty much hate WordPress with a passion. Also look at couchcms if you want a relatively easy way to convert a static site into a cms backed site with a customer access with exactly only the amount of access you want them to have.
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Meeeep.
"Flaw in Elementor and Beaver Addons Let Anyone Hack WordPress Sites"
https://thehackernews.com/2019/12/wordpress-elementor-beaver.html
Amitz, a very stable genius (it's true!) and Grand Rectumfier of the official LESLOS® (LES League of Shitposters).
Certified braindead since 1974 and still perfectly happy.
Here a other page holder
https://appsumo.com/epicpxls/
Squats are the new Push-ups
The addons are done by a third party though. Anyway, with or without site builders, people are going to use lots of plugins anyway and any of them could have vulnerabilities. Using wordpress is eventually going to get your site hacked if you just use the default wordpress installation with softaculous or whatever on a panel. It's not if, but when.
i'd steer clear of elementor for the time being https://threatpost.com/critical-bug-in-wordpress-plugins-open-sites-to-hacker-takeovers/151123/
but there's livecomposer plugin which is easy enough to use and the free version should get most jobs done https://livecomposerplugin.com/
Elementor, even in free version, can give lots of design options. I'd go with that if choosing a page builder.
I chose GeneratePress theme to work with Elementor (it's very well documented, well written, fast - and, like any theme when you are using a page builder - it doesn't affect the design too much).
The problem with elementor is that I don't think you get to keep content written using it if you decide to stop using it. Unlike themes, where posts and pages remain after you change a theme, just looking differently, with Elementor I'm not sure that you will not need to re-write the page content. Could be wrong. Could be there's a tool for export/import, not sure.
WP itself is slowly moving towards being a page builder in itself. Sure, themes and page builders will still have their place, but one will be able to make very nice design even without a page builder (more and more options are added, even more are planned).
WP has its pros and cons. Having weighed them, I had decided to use it and so far so good - even five years after having first started.
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Agree with a lot of things you said. However, Gutenberg (WP's Builder) is nowhere near where I'd give it a try. That being said, I don't see Elementor or Divi going away. They'll just be premium page builders with even more options, updates etc. With the Divi Lifetime license I'm quite interested to see what they have in mind for the years to come
I should check out GeneratePress Theme, too. Nothing bad with a clean theme. I often find myself using a clean theme and Divi Builder plugin instead of Divi Theme. Although Divi Theme is by no means bad.
Ympker's VPN LTD Comparison, Uptime.is, Ympker's GitHub.
WordPress makes a lot of things easy, just that I always worry about the security aspect.
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I do too, a lot. A few of the servers I manage have WordPress sites and it's crazy the amount of compromised installs appear. Biggest giveaway is the mail limit notifications come in.. can be fun cleaning things up, usually don't do that unless paid specifically for that task lol
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tagging @wordpress just for the heck of it. (User Wordpress- hope you will not take comments about CMS wordpress personally!))
Squats are the new Push-ups
From a developer point of view it's great. You can make custom widgets to suit whatever design you need, and then your users can adjust pages to suit without any extra plugins/bloat.
The downside is maybe needs more options out the box.
I don't design websites, but I do get the odd job to implement a design in WP - I've not done one yet where a bit of coding to add custom widgets to gutenberg make the whole thing easy. Especially if it's a style/element that's re-used throughout the side.
There are a lot of quick things you can do at a server level to help, for example not allowing PHP scripts to be executed in the uploads directory. It won't stop everything but it helps.
Maybe I'm just too used to Divi. I don't think Gutenberg is all that bad. It's just not something for me (yet)
Ympker's VPN LTD Comparison, Uptime.is, Ympker's GitHub.
There are a lot of features in wordpress but are "hidden" which may make gutenberg look less useful than it really is. People either don't know or forget they can use css in wordpress. I've managed to achieve some things with gutenberg blocks by playing with the css which would have been quite difficult to achieve with classic wordpress unless you have a visual editor.
You can also, for example, create your own page/post templates with php (by writing it yourself and uploading it to wordpress directory). I'm sure there are a lot of 'hidden' features that I'm unaware of myself. However, it should be noted that wordpress development is an entirely different monster compared to webdev...
no problem sir , i personally use elementor and pro for clients with some extra addon for elementor like the plus addons
Using Elementor for my personal website and have to say it will make your tasks easier!
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